Destiny

Can unconventional thinking unlock the key to a better life? 

Dr. Mike Strouse, President & CEO of Good Life Innovations, takes listeners on an exhilarating journey into creative problem-solving, disability services innovation, and leadership transformation in the premiere episode of The Quest for the Good Life.

Inside this episode, you'll discover:

• How bold, out-of-the-box strategies are reshaping the disability industry and organizational leadership.
• Why Dr. Strouse draws inspiration from Indiana Jones in his pursuit of impactful solutions.
• Unforgettable personal stories, including encounters with Muhammad Ali and profound life lessons from loss.
• A rare glimpse into Dr. Strouse’s poetic reflections on destiny, rules, and audacity—written 30 years ago yet more relevant than ever.

Whether you’re in the disability services field, an organizational leader, or simply someone who craves innovative ideas that challenge the status quo, this episode will ignite your imagination and empower you to pursue your own quest for a meaningful life.

Listen now and rethink what’s possible!  

Links & References: 

• The Rumble in the Jungle

Transcript

Ivo Ivanov (00:00:10):

Hello and welcome to the Quest for the Good Life with Dr. Mike Strauss. This podcast is a production of Good Life University. It is January, 2025, and this is our first episode of the New season. [00:00:30] Our host is naturally Dr. Mike Strauss since his name is in the podcast. I am Evo Ivanov, your sound engineer and fun engineer, and also your co-host with the co-host. First of all, I want to introduce Dr. Strauss and maybe address the purpose and mission of this podcast. Dr. Mike Strauss is [00:01:00] the President and Chief Executive Officer of Good Life Innovations, an organization that has provided comprehensive services for people who need support for almost half a century. Now, Dr. Strauss is a PhD in Applied Behavioral Analysis, an academic, an accomplished speaker, an innovator, an entrepreneur, an educator, a strategist, a leader, [00:01:30] and I believe most importantly, a visionary. He has more than 35 years of experience in the field of applied behavior analysis. Dr. Strauss is responsible for creating very, very innovative solutions for independent living and community support. I've been with Good Life for 38 years, and I can testify that at good life he has done [00:02:00] an incredible job at redefining what is possible for living independently. He believes in empowering people who are in need with the tools, resources, technology, and opportunities they deserve, while also recognizing and rewarding the contributions of their staff and partners.

Ivo Ivanov (00:02:28):

Dr. Strouse, we can talk on and on and on about your experiences, about your credentials, but what I really want to know is how do you become a Renaissance man? How do you end up being who you are and having all this acumen in so many different directions? And when I talk about you, it feels like I'm talking about 10 different people because you've done so many things throughout your life and career, and ultimately you are a leader, but you are also an incredible speaker, an educator, an academic, a parent, a strategist. You are a scientist, a behavioral analyst who is capable of managing very complex systems and individuals, people. So I was thinking about the very purpose of this podcast and about you and how those two things can be disentangled. And then I started thinking, well, why do we need this podcast? There are almost 4 million podcasts in the world right

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:03:59):

Now,

Ivo Ivanov (00:04:00):

And do we need another one? Do we need this one? And I started thinking about my own life as many people would do, and try to find a parallel in their own journey. And I thought about my coaching. I've been coaching for 18 years now, high school basketball and high school soccer. And I remember when I first started coaching, I felt like I really don't have a choice. There comes a point in one's life where you've accumulated a lot of knowledge and you are holding this knowledge and it wants to get out of you. You realize that you must share what you've learned, the skills you acquired, the acumen you've acquired. It is selfish to keep it for yourself. Isn't that our purpose in life, to kind of create continuity, to create succession and pass on the wealth of knowledge that you've acquired? I didn't become a coach because of the money, definitely not or for glory. I wanted to share with the next generation what I knew. I felt that that's my obligation. I kind of feel the same way about this podcast. I feel that you have so much to give to the world to help people, to help other CEOs who need direction to help organizations and individuals on their own journey in life, on their Quest for the Good Life. So I wanted to know more about you. And of course, naturally, my first question is, you are wearing a fedora. Why in the world are you wearing a Fedora? 

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:05:47):

Well, you told me to think a lot about the podcast, why we're doing it, what we want to achieve, and that's kind of where I came up with the Fedora. The truth is, by the way, and that was a very nice intro. I really appreciate it.

Ivo Ivanov (00:06:06):

Not enough, not enough.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:06:08):

We all have our stories. We all have our stories of how we got here and am happy with my story. I wouldn't have asked for it at the time, but I love the life that I lived. I feel a little bit like Forrest Gump. I do, because I've lived that kind of a Forrest Gump life. I mean, when I was six years old, I was at a cafe in Marshfield, Missouri where I grew up, and Cassius Clay came into the restaurant—

Ivo Ivanov (00:06:49):

For the younger listeners. That's Muhammad Ali.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:06:52):

—Yeah. But it was Cassius Clay then,

Ivo Ivanov (00:06:54):

Back then. Yeah.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:06:55):

Yeah. 

Ivo Ivanov (00:06:56):

That is amazing.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:06:57):

I met him three times in my life. 

Ivo Ivanov (00:06:59):

Seriously? 

(00:07:00)

Yeah. Yeah. I met him three times in my life.

Ivo Ivanov (00:07:03):

That's wild.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:07:04):

And the last time I told him about the first time he couldn't speak at that time, his wife would interpret things.

Ivo Ivanov (00:07:12):

The Parkinson’s.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:07:12):

Yeah, because of Parkinson's. And I told he and his wife the story of being on the Spur in Marshfield, Missouri, which was on Route 66.

(00:07:26):

And it was a restaurant that had barbecue, and I was standing out in front of it, and I saw these series of black cars with flags on them pull up. And this guy got out that was bigger in life, and he picked me up and said, “What's going on, little man?” And carried me into the restaurant. 

Ivo Ivanov (00:07:50):

Oh my goodness. 

Dr. Mike Strouse:

Marshfield, Missouri. And I didn't know who it was at the time, didn't really know it at all. And of course, later knew, and realized was that was like, I intersected history then Route 66, whatever. But when I told him that story, his wife, he leaned over to his wife and whispered in her ear and she looked at me and she said, “Barbecue,” in that one word I knew he remembered the darn thing. And it's like, wow, how insignificant I was and how he made me feel. That I mattered. You know what I mean? And I got a hundred stories like that. I got a thousand stories of things that are not supposed to happen to people that happened to us. I've done a lot of fun things in my life. You mentioned stuff, but I don't assign as much special things to it as you do. I think people shouldn't do that about themself anyway, but I have been called creative. I think I am, creative. You'll find though, that when you really look under the covers, I have a process to be creative. So it sounds a little weird that you're an innovator and you're creative, but there's a process to it. There's a system to it, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:09:30):

Yeah.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:09:30):

Some people wouldn't think about that, but I have that history. But I think there's a lot of that, and I'm getting to my fedora here in a second, but the fedora is literally about my idol. And the reason you don't know about it until now, by the way, I have probably 10 fedoras at home.

Ivo Ivanov (00:09:56):

Wow.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:09:57):

I love fedoras. I look for them everywhere. I see that perfect fedora. My wife goes bananas when I buy it because for many, many years I would buy it, put it on, just think it's the greatest thing in the whole and not wear it. And not wear it and not wear it. And the real question is when I love it so much, why didn't I wear it? And it was for one really simple reason. I didn't want to stick out and I wanted to fit in, and nobody else was wearing a fedora. And so I never wore it. Now where I am in my life

(00:10:36):

Now,

(00:10:37):

And you asked me what do I want this podcast to be about? I thought, well, I probably should wear my fedora because what I want the podcast to be is why I always bought the fedoras and why I wanted to wear them, but I didn't. I want this podcast to be about really finding what you really want to do and doing that and living a good life, the whole idea of that. But my idol, you always have those movies you fall in love with, right? Because they capture everything that you really either think you are, but nobody knows about it or you want to be. Well, for me, it was Indiana Jones. I wanted to be Indiana Jones.

Ivo Ivanov (00:11:34):

And he had a, famously was wearing his hat. You don't have a whip.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:11:38):

I don't have a whip. And the reason I don't is if you know my history. I trained horses. 

Ivo Ivanov (00:11:47):

Of course, yes. But you never used the whip.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:11:48):

Oh, no. So that was one part of it. That was me, but the hat was me, and what he represented was the coolest thing in the world. And everybody's got that fantasy of what they really, who they think they are. And I can't remember who it was, and I know it wasn't them that created a quote there, but there's some people who dream of sandcastles in the sky, and there's other people who move in. And it is like, I've had this idea who I am, and then I've just kept it to myself. And my wife won't let me buy any more fedoras anymore unless I start wearing them. So I said, well, I'm going to start wearing them now, and you'll see me in them more now than before. But Indiana Jones was my idol because he had a lot of the things that I've always aspired to be. He's a scientist, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:12:54):

Yes. And an adventurer.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:12:56):

He's an adventurer, but not just an adventurer. An Adventurer with purpose.

Ivo Ivanov (00:13:02):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:13:02):

Right? Yes. And he had goals that were just stupid. I wasn't as a word, as his goal was like, “I'm going to discover the purpose of the world”, or “I'm going to find the holy grail,” right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:13:19):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:13:21):

And he did it. And it is like everybody, you could say, well, I'm going to go look for the grail, and everybody look at you and say, “well, you're just stupid because you're wasting your time”.

Ivo Ivanov (00:13:35):

Right?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:13:36):

But that's kind of how I feel. If you're a scientist and you want to do something big,

Ivo Ivanov (00:13:44):

You must take chances.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:13:47):

And that's kind of where the hat comes in. And that's why I liked him is like, you're a scientist. You want to do something big. And you could tell people, all these other smart people in the world, all these other smart people, you could tell them that I'm going to find the grail. And there's antiquity scholars and there's all these other people go, “you're an idiot. You don't have the right stuff. You're not good enough. I mean, leave it to somebody else.”

Ivo Ivanov (00:14:17):

Yeah.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:14:19):

And you go, “well, yeah, but they're not trying. They're not really trying. So why are you telling me I can't do something?” Or” why am I not the guy?” And I think that's kind of like, I want us to understand we have been fighting social problems in this country. We've been fighting them a lot of times. This podcast is going to challenge a lot of stuff. I don't think we've always, as a scientist, I don't think we've thought of them the right way. If you're creative, I don't think you've really looked at these problems the right way and come up with the right solutions. We've sort of what is that edge when trying to do the same thing over and over is It's

Ivo Ivanov (00:15:20):

Madness.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:15:21):

It's madness.

Ivo Ivanov (00:15:22):

And if you expect different result while we're doing the same thing over, if you expect

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:15:24):

Different results, and

Ivo Ivanov (00:15:26):

It's a definition of madness,

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:15:28):

And my definition is you're going to hear shows where we look at that kind of stuff. And I'm going to say, look, in Kansas, we probably have studied the same thing across 20 years. And those studies are sitting somebody where on somebody's desk, we keep approaching the problem, doing the same thing. We're in love, for example, with training. You know me, I'm big on training. I love it. But it's part of the plan. It's not THE plan. And somebody, people think the plan is training and they think it's the solution for everything. I always say a lot of the conference talks that I get, I say sometimes you use training when that's not the problem, but you want to fix it with training because it's easy. It's like Ivo, close your eyes and think of the worst date you've ever had in your entire life, a worst date, and then go out with her again, and it's another worst date you've ever had. You thought the last one was bad, this is even worse. And then it's like, okay, well, the way we had approached that problem is we're going to train you how to love a bad date.

(00:16:41):

Well, that's not the problem. You're just going out with the wrong person. So we fix problems the wrong way. We sometimes define them the wrong way. I mean, there's a science to this. There's a science to fixing things. And I want to talk about what that science actually is, give examples of it and kind of show this. But the main thing I want to do is I want to be Indiana Jones. I've only got a couple years left in the podcast world probably, and doing what I'm doing right now, and I don't want to spend it doing the same thing over and over. I want us to look at the kind of goals that Indiana did.

Ivo Ivanov (00:17:35):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:17:36):

Like big ones. Stop looking at the small ones, look at the big ones and approach it with science, but determination and some, and don't care if people think you're stupid because you're doing something that everybody may have tried to do and didn't do. I'm real proud of what we've done. I mean, we've made, we talk about GoodLife here, but really my greatest accomplishments and what we've done together is changing staffing stability across the country. Some of the people we worked in, the agencies, you don't know what it's like when they come back to you. Last week, I just had an interaction with the CEO who said that we changed their lives.

Ivo Ivanov (00:18:29):

Yeah. I've read one of your publications 20 years ago, and it took 20 years for me to realize how prophetic it was. It was called "Turning Over Turnover.”

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:18:42):

It was

Ivo Ivanov (00:18:44):

A very, very successful and kind of cutting edge look into the problem of turnover. But

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:18:53):

But you know what the most important thing was of that whole study? The most important thing of that whole study, and it was said in the title, but it kind of backfired on me, is that it was turnover. Turnover. But

(00:19:06):

The W double or however you say that of that was that turnover suggests turbulence, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:19:14):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:19:16):

But by turning over turnover, what I really wanted to say is it's the crappiest measure you could ever have. And it exemplifies why we spend most of our life working on the wrong problem. Now, the reason I say that, and it took me 20 years to understand really how true that feeling was after working with literally dozens and dozens of agencies across the country and helping with staff stability, which is what I call it. But after doing that, we started seeing a pattern. Some people would come up to and say, we got 40% openings. But the crazy thing, Dr. Strouse, is our turnover measures aren't too bad. So we're doing pretty good on turnover, sitting there looking, you got 40% openings in youth and your turnover is low. Oh, yeah. Turns out they were right. And it proved everything that I hate about that measure because turnover, what was happening when they were 40% vacant is they had lost all the people who would be there for six months. The early people are the ones that turn over the one month, the three a month, the six. Those are the people just constantly turning over.

(00:20:49):

But then there's this group of people over at the end that's been there for a year, two years, three years, five years. They don't turn over. What was happening is they had 40% turnover. What they were missing is all the early turbulence, and they had no pipeline. They had no pipeline of new people coming in. So actually their turnover measure went down. And I'm saying, well, how's that working for you? We're about ready to crumple. Well, way back 20 years ago, we were in that research. We published,

(00:21:25):

I basically said, the problem shouldn't be turnover. The problem should be the number of different people involved in care, because turnover is only affected by some things, but the number of different people involved in care is affected by so many different little pieces. How do you assign people to a person in a home? How do you fill vacant shifts? What about call offs? What about openings about, I mean, there's a whole lot of things that affect the number of people involved in care, but it's a single measure that basically shows what life is like for the person's perspective. It's the most accurate measure of stability for them. 

Ivo Ivanov (00:22:14):

Yeah. It was a very profound and unexpected conclusion from this study. And frankly back then, a little controversial. And now it's proven to be completely true. And like I said, a little prophetic. I was thinking about you and how in the last three decades we've become more than colleagues. We've become friends. And I was thinking about what you said about Muhammad Ali, because I thought I knew everything, but this story really blew my mind. And then I thought about your approach to solving problems. You identify a problem, you look at the problem, and then you use a very unconventional approach, usually to a problem. Muhammad Ali, do you remember the fight with George Foreman in 1974?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:23:09):

My favorite fight,

Ivo Ivanov (00:23:10):

The Rope-a-dope in Zaire. So that was in ‘74. I am old enough too, to remember that fight. And he was,

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:23:19):

Everybody thought he was going to lose. Yeah,

Ivo Ivanov (00:23:21):

Because George Foreman,

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:23:22):

He was so formidable.

Ivo Ivanov (00:23:23):

Yeah, he was so powerful. His right hook was basically the most feared weapon in boxing, and he was so much stronger than Muhammad Ali. Everybody thought, oh, he's going to obliterate Muhammad Ali.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:23:39):

Yeah, it wouldn't last a round. Nobody was lasting a round.

Ivo Ivanov (00:23:43):

Yeah. Muhammad Ali looked at it and identified a problem, and he said, okay, I can't win. So the rumor is, and nowadays it's kind of confirmed that his people, he asked his people to loosen the ropes on the boxing ring. And when the fight started, he immediately pushed his back against the ropes and allowed George Foreman to pound, give him body shot after body shot after body shot, barely protecting himself. What happened was the ropes were so loosened up that they were absorbing all the power of George Foreman. 

(00:24:20):

So he was basically bouncing back with each punch. His body wasn't absorbing the punches, the ropes were absorbing the punches. George Foreman eventually got exhausted, got tired from punching for nothing, punching the ropes. And Muhammad Ali felt, yes, out of nowhere, he appeared. He was acting like he was worn out. He felt the weakness, the exhaustion in his opponent, and bounced on it and killed him. So that was an unconventional approach to a problem. And what I want to tell the listeners is this is a podcast when you can come, it's a space for you where you can safely wear your fedora and search for the holy grail, and you will have the best guide available. You will have our own Indiana Jones here wearing his fedora and using his wealth of knowledge and no whip to guide you on your Quest to the Good Life.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:25:30):

And it is going to be a fun one. We're going to involve other people where here's some of their stories. I mean, we don't have enough stories. And anybody knows me for teaching, knows I always teach with analogies.

(00:25:48):

I think that's what helps people remember things. So every time I present in a conference, all my presentations are filled with analogies. I talk about Blockbuster and Netflix or those kind of things before. And I talk about those things before we talk about the solution, because I want people to understand that these backdrops on stuff, I mean, I think I'm defined. My creativity is definitely my heritage. I think it's a little of my genetics and then the experience that I've had, and finally the training and the science. But I wouldn't have got to the training in science without my background, which is pretty unusual, but I wouldn't trade it. It wasn't easy on my growing up and those sorts of things. But I like my life, and I'll tell you this story because it was important, and there's all before stories too, but everybody's got these stories, and I think it's important to have stories woven into things that make sense. But if you want to know one of the most important things that everybody had, these little things that are important to them along their life, Muhammad Ali

(00:27:28):

Was an important thing to me. It was a big deal for me and other people I've met. But interestingly, my mother and father, I think died in 1991, 10 days apart, and they were six months before their 50th wedding anniversary. So they were very close people. And my mother had cancer, and she ran a dry cleaning thing, [00:28:00] and it was all environmental. The solvents around the dry cleaning, it caused her to have cancer.

Ivo Ivanov (00:28:05):

Oh, no.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:28:06):

And she was treated, and then it was cancer free. And then on her fifth year, which is that magical point where you're supposed to get to it, reoccurred, and then it was pervasive and she was dying from that. And my dad has this other history we can talk about sometime, but my dad was one of these. He was in navigator in World War II, and he was in Pearl Harbor.

Ivo Ivanov (00:28:34):

Wow.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:28:35):

Yeah.

Ivo Ivanov (00:28:37):

I did not know that.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:28:38):

He became a hundred percent disabled veteran.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:28:42):

And that was important for me for lots of reasons. But he was a navigator in a plane that got shot down in Pearl Harbor.

Ivo Ivanov (00:28:55):

That's incredible.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:28:56):

And then he was in a body cast. He broke his back.  He was in a body cast for almost 18 months from what I've been told. That's where he met my mother. And they ended up getting married and things like that. But we had to be very resourceful because he couldn't do everything. But the power of the story forward was that when my mother was at the end of her life, she had to go to the hospital because she was in a lot of pain. And then as she was being hauled off to the hospital in an ambulance from our country home in the Ozarks, my dad and I were standing on the porch. She was leaving, and my dad had a massive stroke. So while that went, one ambulance was on the way to Springfield Hospital with my mother. Another ambulance was coming to our house, passing each other to pick up my dad. And they ended up being around five rooms apart, same hospital. And my mother basically was in a coma, and my father was in a coma. My mother came out of that and said, where's dad? Of course, I had to tell her in a short period of time. Later she passed away, and then we had her funeral. I can't remember whether it was one or two or three days after that.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:30:32):

My dad kind of rebound a little bit and went with it and asked where mom was; missed her funeral. I told him, and then he died. So they had two funerals like this, 10 days apart. I was in the hospital that whole period of time, and it was a heart wrenching story for all these nurses and stuff. Well, when my dad finally passed away, this amazing nurse, just one of these angels, these people that just were meant to do what they did, she came in, she gave me a book. I think it was like 1500 page book. And I going, that's interesting. And it was a book called "Sarum". You ever heard of that book?

Ivo Ivanov (00:31:19):

No.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:31:21):

It's the history of Salisbury England from 10,000 BC to present. It's a historical fiction, so it's kind of true, and it's kind of not. So what it did is it traced four families through time from the beginning, 10,000 BC to present. And you started reading the book and the bottom line and the moral of the story. You figured it out at the end. And why she gave it to me changed my life. But what was happening is these four families were being traced through time. And what you realize is there was this one family that was a hunter and gather, and there's others. It was in commerce. There was another family that they had four different themes and they stuck with that. And 105 hundred years later, a thousand years later, 5,000 years later, all that forward, you started seeing these things. And at some point in time you could actually predict in that book what was going to happen next because you were tracing these people throughout time and everybody behaved the same way. They did the same thing. And I called her and I said, "Why'd you give me that book? I think I know, but why'd you do it?" She said, "Because I wanted you to know that your parents were living on through you,"

Ivo Ivanov (00:32:52):

Beautiful.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:32:55):

I mean, there was the lesson on that though, Ivo was, there is a lot about your history and experiences, but there's also a lot about genetics and who you are and your heritage and your family that make you who you are. And that's when I kind of got interested. I want to start, go back and look at my family. And that's when I found out I come from a family of artists, of inventors, of sort of pretty creative people. And so it made me feel good

Ivo Ivanov (00:33:25):

Visionaries.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:33:26):

About that sort of stuff. And so that's why I decided, okay, I'll wear that badge a little bit. I don't mind that.

Ivo Ivanov (00:33:33):

You got me thinking about something. So since I was a kid, I've been obsessed with octopuses. I love the octopus. Octopus is the most intelligent creature in the biosphere. They're problem solvers. They're probably the nature's most efficient problem solvers. And the intelligence, the only reason they didn't develop a second signal system and didn't take over the world is they live a very short life. The giant Pacific octopus only lives five years, so they couldn't make that evolutionary leap and develop societies and so on. But they're insanely intelligent. They have eight brains and three hearts. They're very alien. In fact, a lot of scientists believe that their DNA arrived on earth from a meteorite because they're so different from everything else. As you know, they're shifters.

Ivo Ivanov (00:34:30):

They can do all kinds of stuff, but one of their best skills is really problem solving. They can open jars, they're escape artists. They see a problem and they solve it, and they can develop relationships with people. They remember faces. They have a sense of humor and all that stuff. So something interesting happened. About a hundred years ago, this fisherman was walking through shallow water and his hands were full with fish. He dropped a vase, like a piece of pottery. He dropped it in the water and he couldn't pick it up. So he went to the shore, he left everything he was holding and went to pick it up. And when he picked it up, there was an octopus inside of it. So he found that very curious. So he took the octopus and put the piece of pottery back in the water and left.

Ivo Ivanov (00:35:30):

And in a little bit there was another octopus in it. And he realized that the octopuses go inside this shape vase, and they can get out. And there's nothing really special about the shape of it. It's a rather standard shape. But he started using this to catch octopuses. And this became the standard octopus trap all over the world. They call it the Takotsubo. The Takotsubo is a trap for octopuses to this day. Everybody catches octopuses that way. Their biggest problem evolutionary is that the octopuses became very tasty and developed a massive, massive enemy in men. So we catch them for their meat. But something amazing happened, and your story provoked me to remember this. In the late sixties, a doctor discovered this, the syndrome of the broken heart. It was known back then that when two people love each other and they live together for a very long time, 30, 40, 50 years, when one of them passes, the other one very often also passes away within a week or two weeks, sometimes on the next day.

Ivo Ivanov (00:36:57):

Science used to call this “The syndrome of the broken heart.” But what this Japanese doctor found out in the sixties is that the heart of a person that's grieving changes completely its shape proving that there's a direct correlation between the central nervous system and this muscle. It's a muscle. It changes dramatically, its shape. And this is why you develop this cardiomyopathy and die. If you survive for a month or so with this completely changed shape of your heart, it will go back to its original shape and you will live, but you are at a very high risk for a few weeks. What was really incredible is the shape of the heart is the exact same shape of the Takotsubo of the pottery that catches octopuses.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:37:59):

Wow.

Ivo Ivanov (00:37:59):

They now call this the Takotsubo syndrome. They don't call it anymore, "The syndrome of the broken heart," scientists call it the Takotsubo syndrome. And I find it extremely poetic that the smartest animal in the world cannot find its way out of the shape just as our sorrow cannot find itself out of the shape and ultimately kills us. And speaking of poetry, you brought some poetry and I wanted to know why.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:38:32):

Well, I don't want to overstate the creativity innovation, but creativity and innovation are important in our field and we need more of it, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:38:48):

Absolutely.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:38:49):

And there's a bit of a science and there's a bit of a mindset to it. But I grew up when I realized I've always felt creative and people have always said that I have been creative and innovative. Almost everybody who meets me and looks at some of the stuff we do, and the way we do it thinks that well, that's creative or that's innovative and it solves problems. And I think part of that in my growing up was being put in situations where we didn't have a lot, but we had to solve problems and we were resourceful  and I would say persistent. And those are good traits for the most part. And so we would solve problems in very creative ways. But you know what you said there, there's so many truths of all of that. I don't have any boundaries of what I think people say outside of the box maybe. But definitely I don't have any boundaries on it. I don't look at things conventionally.

(00:40:05):

I'm an avid reader. And I think that is always a trait because when you read about different things, you learn about how other people do things. And so it's not like I'm being creative. I look at other people who are creative. I like to spend time with people that aren't like me. I think I told you this. You have those business groups that you spend time with and people have invited me from time to time to be part of business leaders in my field. And I've shied away from that, not because they're not cool people, they're super cool people, but I wanted to spend time with business leaders that's not in my field. I wanted to hang around people that did things that nobody that I hung around with did to see if there were commonalities and things like that.

(00:40:59):

But I think these defining moments when I got my PhD and people were talking about like, yeah, that's really creative and that's a trait that I have. And they were just joking about it, and we were kind of talking about it a little bit. And they said, I told 'em my background. There would be people who are artists and there would be people who were creative in my background, resourceful maybe as much as creative. And one guy said, or one woman actually said, you could probably be a poet. And I thought about that because I never wrote a poem in my life. And then another guy said, "Strouse, you can never be a poet." So I didn't really have anything to do, and I was kind of coming down from my dissertation defense and I was a doctor and all that stuff, which is isn't that in some ways just isn't that big deal. It is kind of like after you do it, it's like, okay, let's do something else kind of a thing.

(00:42:12):

But I went home and I thought, "I wonder if I could be a poet." Just like everything else and how I approached things, so, why don't I get a bottle of wine out or two by myself, and why don't I see if I can write some poetry? And I couldn't just do that. I said, well, why don't I write poems that define my life. So write four or five poems that define who I am. And I started at about nine o'clock that night, and I got done about four thirty in the morning. I wrote five poems and I'd only share four of 'em with you.

Ivo Ivanov (00:43:04):

Oh, please do. Thank you so much.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:43:06):

But I will tell you, it was fun. By the way, I've never wrote another poem. First of all, I don't know if they're any good. So it's not like we hold him out there as like, oh man, he's a great poet. But you know what? It was pretty darn cool--it was a cool thing to do. You ought to try doing it sometime. You ought to say, write five poems that define your life. And I can tell you that happened August 12th, 1995.

Ivo Ivanov (00:43:47):

Oh, I'm dying.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:43:49):

Wrote five poems. I've never written any since. And how many? 95? That would be what? 30 years later?

Ivo Ivanov (00:44:01):

Yeah, 30 years. Exactly.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:44:02):

30 years later. Today, I can tell you I wouldn't change a word on them to define my life 30 years.

Ivo Ivanov (00:44:09):

I remember standing...

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:44:10):

Mean, isn't that wild?

Ivo Ivanov (00:44:11):

I was at the department when you defended your dissertation, and I think afterwards we went somewhere to celebrate. I had no idea that just a few hours later, you're going to end up writing poetry. It's incredible. And I really want to hear that. Is that possible?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:44:31):

Yeah, I can do that.

Ivo Ivanov (00:44:32):

Oh, perfect. Thank you so much.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:44:33):

And maybe this will just sort of define what this podcast is going to be about. So I don't know that there's order to them, but I'll pretend there is. The first one is about destiny. And by the way, remember I talked to you about, “Sarum.”

Ivo Ivanov (00:44:50):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:44:51):

So "Destiny" made me realize that as a behavioral analyst, I sort of would define destiny as well. Look at "Sarum" all of a sudden you're starting to predict things based, based upon all this history and stuff, because people just behave a certain way. I'm a behavioral analyst. I love the idea that you could predict behavior. I love that. I always thought, well, maybe I could be a profiler or something like that. It'd be a really a cool thing to be able to do, to be able to predict what somebody's going to do next, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:45:29):

Yes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:45:30):

So the first one I called "Destiny."

(00:45:35): “DESTINY” by Dr. Mike Strouse

What if there's no such thing as chance? 

What if you had a purpose, which is: “Learn through life's lessons”? 

Would you listen more carefully, behave differently, be more attentive? 

Would life events be more important or interesting? 

What if others had destinies? 

Would this make them more important? 

Would you respect them more? 

Perhaps this would be good. 

What if you were supposed to read this?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:46:16):

So the purpose of that one was, I have been my entire life, I have had these experiences where I needed that to happen. Exactly then. People, GoodLife. I have been surrounded. I have the greatest supported job in the entire world. I have the people that are with me have come into my life exactly at the right time. I feel it's like that can't be by chance, I don't believe. And this is a belief I've had in my entire life. And if you've had so many experiences where something happened to you at the exact right time, you can call it a guardian angel or you can call it a life lesson that had to happen just then. I feel that there is Destiny. I feel like the big bang wasn't just a big bang. I feel that when you start looking at how things are happening, there's a method to it. And we're part of it, but we each have our own thing. So I feel like I have a purpose. People should think that they are important.

Ivo Ivanov (00:47:41):

Yes,

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:47:42):

They should think that they are important. And I want everybody who is associated with this podcast to believe that they should have read that. So that's one thing I want. I want to make sure that, oh, I heard that. I want to be part of this. I have a purpose. You might not know what it is, but I guarantee you have a purpose. And it isn't by chance, because I mean, it could be magical, but it also could be just all these historic things that are happening to you that are unraveling this "Sarum" effect where you've had 10,000 years of people before you, that's making your behavior predictable.

Ivo Ivanov (00:48:30):

Everything is connected, and your poem "Destiny" is far more than it goes deeper than you yourself might feel because it touches on an ancient, ancient philosophical dilemma that has to do with determinism versus free will.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:48:55):

Exactly. Exactly. I mean, it is exactly about that, and that's what I thought. But from a common language perspective, people like to talk about destiny and purpose, and I want everybody at GoodLife. I would tell you, in fact, a colleague I wrote a recommendation for earlier this morning, and it was a big deal there he is like GoodLife has a purpose. It's got a mission, it's got a purpose and passion fuels that. Passion fuels that. But people got to be like, they got to have a purpose. You got to get 'em locked into your purpose. And so part of this podcast in my mind is like, we got a purpose on this podcast. Now I don't want to just have it myself. This isn't, by the way, Ivo, what you said of just educating people. I want there to be a national focus on a couple of purposes. And I want to get that energy you're going. I think maybe we can start it and it’s like that's going to go back into my, I think my third poem, but it is going to be about that. But this is my second one.

Ivo Ivanov (00:50:06):

Okay, perfect.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:50:06):

My second one's called "Rules."

Ivo Ivanov (00:50:09):

Rules. Can't Wait.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:50:10):

And Rules, as you know, I don't really follow them much. I don't really follow them much. Some people call it outside the box. I just call 'em stupid rules, right? So the second poem I wrote was about rules. Here it is.

Ivo Ivanov (00:50:28):

Oh boy...

(00:50:28): “Rules” by Dr. Mike Strouse

Life is short. 

So what rules are important? 

I maintain only big rules, not small ones. 

There are laws, obey their spirit and as for being considerate, considerate it. 

But the little rules are easy to spot. 

They're the ones imposed on yourself, aren't they not? 

And be aware of small rules imposed by others, except those of course given by mothers.

 And finally, never live your life as others see fit. This will surely break your spirit.

Ivo Ivanov (00:51:12):

Oh, I love this.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:51:13):

So that was about rules and the whole idea. By the way, I have never read these poems as stupid as they may sound to some people without being emotional about it. And I think it's because they're supposed to be about me and they are about me. If you know anything about me that, Rules are not my thing because they're confining and sort of conventional. And the first thing to understand, I mean, yes, you want to see how people typically do things, but if they haven't been successful, maybe you should look a little broader, right? Rules can constrain people in ways that thwart their spirit and change sort of what's possible. Change the rules and new things happen. Think of any game, change the rules. What about the evolution of Football?

(00:52:23):

Is it offense-oriented? Is it defense-oriented? Do we protect? We didn't always protect the quarterback. Now we do. I mean, all these rules change the game, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:52:33):

Not obeying the rules is the number one rule about you. And yeah, you're right. In sports, in everything really, before Mahomes showed up, before Patrick Mahomes showed up, nobody was throwing the ball across their body diagonally. He shows up, starts doing this. Now everybody's doing it because they realized this is extremely effective.

(00:52:58):

Nobody was doing 'No look' passes. Now everybody is. Magic Johnson was the first one showed up, was looking one way and passing the basketball the other way. Now it's a standard technique in basketball. So this is what you do as well. You break the rules and you find a new innovative way to do it. Poetry comes from a special place in a human being. I respect people that are capable of writing poetry because they are unafraid. You have to be very brave to strip these layers of yourself that protect you from the rest of the world and let your soul be bare. And I believe poetry comes from the same place in a human being where great music comes from. Poetry is really music without notes.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:53:49):

And you don't have to be brave to write poetry. You have to be brave to say it because I did this to capture me. This is the first time I've shared it, is the coming out party.

Ivo Ivanov (00:54:04):

Took years.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:54:04):

And I'm not a poet, but I wrote poetry 30 years ago because somebody said I couldn't. And I wanted to find out if I could. And I kind of felt like, okay, I did that. But what happened along the way is I kind of realized how important it was and how much I learned about myself by writing five poems about me, about who I am. It really did define me. So the last two I'll share seem like they're kind of the same thing, but they're very different. The next one's called "The Third Tablet."

(00:54:50): “The Third Tablet” by Dr. Mike Strouse

There might be a third tablet. 

You know, Moses only had two hands. 

Sound ridiculous? Probably so. 

But wouldn't the rest of the commandments be good for the soul? 

Is it something you might seek? Perhaps for a week? 

You never know.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:55:20):

And that is in honor of the audacious. That is a testament to the audacious, the idea that there might be something out there that you don't expect and it's worth looking for. And just because nobody found it doesn't mean that it's not there.

Ivo Ivanov (00:55:48):

 The Holy Grail?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:55:50):

Not yet. That's the last one.

Ivo Ivanov (00:55:52):

Oh, great.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:55:53):

That's the last one. But the third tablet for me was, we're limited not only by the rules, but by sort of the dogma that there's two tablets.

Ivo Ivanov (00:56:09):

Yeah.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:56:13):

I don't want to get into the scholar of, there is or isn't, but I'm just saying that, I picked that, because it would be ludicrous to most people. But the more ludicrous something sounds, the more likely nobody's going to look. And I think that's crazy. Some things are worth looking for.

Ivo Ivanov (00:56:34):

I love this,

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:56:35):

Right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:56:36):

The theology of audacity. It's beautiful.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:56:40):

When somebody came up with the BHAG, the "Big Hairy, Audacious Goals," I thought I didn't come up with that, but it was something that I wished I would have because they're really important. They're important because sometimes they can never be achieved. It's more of a quest, it  is something you just spend your life doing and you get closer, but you never get there, which is the name GoodLife. It is that whole idea that a Good Life, I'm living a good life. And you are until you think, well, could it be better? Can it be better? So it's like as soon as you get there, there's something more. Right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:29):

Yeah.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:57:30):

So "The Third Tablet" was the BHAG. It's like it's audacious and it is worth looking for a little while at least, right?

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:43):

Yes. Beautiful.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:57:44):

Last one that I'll share. It's called "Searching for the Holy Grail."

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:49):

Oh my gosh. Really?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:57:50):

Yeah.

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:52):

I'm sorry. I didn't know!

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:57:53):

Yeah,

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:54):

I didn't know. Perfection.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:57:55):

It's called "Searching for the Holy Grail."

Ivo Ivanov (00:57:57):

Wow. Excellent.

(00:57:58): “The Quest for the Holy Grail” By Dr. Mike Strouse

I quest for the holy grail. 
Surely I'm not worthy to look. 

Maybe someone who knows the good book might find the right trail. 

While this may be true, please give me my due, as it is I, not they who quest. 

So who really is best?

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:58:23):

And the idea behind that for me was there's all these people out there that's so smart. I mean, I spend time with them and especially scientists and other people that are so smart, think of people in antiquities and all that. There's so many worthy people to look. What if they're not looking? And basically it's like if I started looking for it, they go, "Well, why you? You're not worthy. I'M worthy." Yeah, but you're not looking.

Dr. Mike Strouse (00:59:12):

And the whole idea of that is, again, there's all these limitations and back pressure put on people that we need to pick somebody really important to do that. It's like, well, if there was somebody really important to do that, then why do we have to ask them to do it? You know, Passion is important. Purpose is important. Destiny is important. Being audacious is important. All those things are important. And being crazy enough to tackle something and do it, it's all important. And you don't have to be the smartest or have the best credentials. You have to have the passion and the desire and the determination to pursue something without the benefit of all the rules that's out there and all the constraints that's out there. It's like, go after it. Go after it. And so if I have to say what I would love to see happen with this podcast, we're going to go on a bit of a quest and we're not going to have a lot of rules, and we're all not going to say that we can't help and do it. We're not going to condemn people for trying or to say they're not worthy or that we're not going to say it's stupid.

Ivo Ivanov (01:00:58):

You have to allow yourself to dream and be audacious and go on quests and drink wine and write poetry. You told me before the podcast started that you invent things. You allow yourself to be imaginative and improvise. And most of the time, those inventions that you come up with are a function of necessity. That necessity is the mother of invention, right?

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:01:25):

It is. Yeah.

Ivo Ivanov (01:01:26):

Well, what we've learned from the podcast and your foray in poetry is that yes, the mother is necessity. The father is probably red wine,

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:01:38):

And then all this stuff in the news, news now that it causes cancer. So it's like, oh man, that's horrible. But I have one glass a night and then occasionally more.

Ivo Ivanov (01:01:51):

Yeah. There's so much about you that I understand better. You love pigs with wings. You have statues here in your studio with pigs that are flying

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:08):

Flying Pigs.

Ivo Ivanov (01:02:09):

Yeah. And this is directly related to when pigs fly, when people say

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:16):

No. Somebody remember what happened, Ivo, somebody, when we were creating technology in 1999--

Ivo Ivanov (01:02:23):

before technology existed!

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:25):

--right after which we started doing it, it was the, what was...

Ivo Ivanov (01:02:29):

the dot-com link,

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:31):

the 2000 where everything was going to shut down. We were going to have our

Ivo Ivanov (01:02:35):

Y2K bug.

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:36):

Yeah, Y2K. But when we were doing that, and somebody came and saw what we were doing, she said about remote support in the year 1999, they came and they said, we'll do that when pigs fly.

Ivo Ivanov (01:02:50):

And ever since pigs been flying all over.

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:02:52):

You come to GoodLife, you go down the halls, all you see is flying pigs, right?

Ivo Ivanov (01:03:00):

Yeah, yeah. Well, we hit one hour and obviously we can talk for days, and we will in the next weeks in segments.

Dr. Mike Strouse (01:03:11):

We can talk about minute about what we're going to do.

Ivo Ivanov (01:03:15):

But obviously we promise you that we will keep coming at you with new episodes and new ways to Raid Lost Arks. And for now though, we have to wrap it up. 

Ivo Ivanov (01:03:30):

This was the quest for the Good Life with Dr. Mike Strouse. Today's episode was produced by Megan Olafson and recorded at The GoodLife University Studios. Sound editing and sound engineering were provided by me, your co-host with the co-most, Ivo Ivanov. Together, we thank you for listening and promise you that "The Quest for the Good Life" will continue next week.